124. Hurricane Swap Dodge Demon , Working With The Grand Tour, Building A Racetrack w/ Matt Zurbrick

For Roadkill, we did the Hurricane Swap. It would piss people off, like, why did you use a demon? And it's like, well, I had the car. Holy, this is the green tour. One of the producers of the show called me and was like explaining what they wanted to do. I'm like, we're in like the renaissance of like the ultimate horsepower cars.

Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the Minnoxide podcast. I'm your host, Harris, AKA Minnoxide, man of many automotive aspirations, and I'm here with my Ford loving co-host, Dan. Gunnit Garage. Did you notice I dropped the mister the last two times?

Did you?

Yeah. It was too confusing for people.

Why? Is that not formal enough?

Yeah, it's not formal enough.

Yeah.

And today we are at 5 O Clock Garage. We're continuing our Detroit trip, and this one's kind of been a long time coming. We met you, what was it, SEMA?

I think so.

Yeah. We were introduced by Justin White.

Every time we run into you, things get a little blurry, so I'm not sure where it was when.

But yeah, go ahead and tell us what 5 O Clock Garage is. You got a lot of fun toys back here. You have done some very cool projects. Yeah, just take it from there. Tell us a little bit about yourself and we'll see where we go.

Oh, hard to begin. So 5 O Clock Garage, it's evolved. So I started this company just over four years ago. And originally, I started in the graphics printing world. And so we do licensed graphics for Stellanus. So I came up with the idea to do, like I was always like a Jeep enthusiast and I was like, started doing research on like no one's licensed Jeep graphics. So I'm like, let me put a pitch deck together. Put a pitch deck together. Gave it to Tim Kaniscus at the time. Saw him at a car show, literally kept the deck in my car. And I was like, if I run into him, I'm gonna show it to him. Showed him the proposal and he's like, let's do this. Next day, I was on the phone with one of his guys, which was a Sunday, which was awesome. And then started the process. And getting contracts to OEMs is a treat. It took me two years to get everything signed to look. But yeah, so the big thing about our business is, so we are a full print shop, whether it's, you know, graphics, full wraps, design work. And then we've evolved into a bunch of other printing to like anything in the print industry. And we're getting ready to grow again into like the apparel world. So kind of stars aligned and just made sense to keep growing our printing operation. But on top of that, we grew into the custom car world. So it was really cool. Once I kicked off kind of the Jeep graphics side of things, I was working with Jeep's design studio at the time, and we were doing some prototype designs. And so the head of Jeep design at the time, Mark Allen, had come to my shop and he had saw that I actually had some Jeeps. And he's like, oh, you're really into these. He's like, did you build that? And I was like, yeah. And he's like, well, how'd you feel about doing some of our concept work? And that's kind of where it kicked off, which was super cool. And so the first vehicle we did with them was the 20th anniversary of Rubicon 392. And then we've been doing work with them ever since. So it's been a kind of unique niche business. So we specialize in not only the graphics, but doing a lot of the wraps for the OEMs. And so whether it's, you know, vehicles for commercial shows, ads, and then into, you know, cars that go to shows like SEMA, we're involved with almost every Mopar SEMA project, everything for Easter Jeep Safari, and then random shows throughout. And then once we started that, then it turned into even more custom work. And my previous shop was 4,000 square feet. And within that 4,000 square feet, once you guys got to see my printing facility, it takes up a lot of room. I mean, my print shop is as big as my old shop. And we had it stuffed with cars. And so it's kind of evolved into multiple parts of our business to where, yes, we're doing graphics, design work, wraps, but also modifying cars too. And so then the opportunity came to acquire this building, more over 30,000 square feet. And now we're growing into different segments of print, but also modifying cars. And my big thing is, I love the OEM work. It's fun to be able to work on the new stuff, work with designers, but also be the first ones to drive the new stuff. And so it's kind of like a blessing in disguise. I never thought starting a graphics business would turn into the rest of this. And then just being an automotive enthusiast, I get to work with the guys who created these cars. And I mean, I work every other week. I'm working with designers and get the opportunity to, you know, acquire these cars, use them, have fun with them. You know, it's kind of a living. I have my dream job. Like, I get to wake up every day and do what I love. Like, if there's stressful weeks, yeah, we deal with them. Just had one. But I get to have a lot of fun, too. You know, it's not only my business, but it's my hobby. And being able to combine both is the best thing ever. Do I get a lot of time to play with my own stuff? No. But it's there.

Yeah.

And so that's kind of what this building is. It's evolving. But we moved in here. Like, I got the building to move in about a year ago, and this was originally an ice rink. And so the rink was still here. So taking all that down, updating this building, I think, is 50, 60 years old now. But it's got great guts. Like, it's an iron building, it's clear span. And so, like, updating the electric hole, getting everything set up in the back, getting all this set up like we're about to get start, a bunch of construction up here so that I can bring in another side of our printing. And so it's a lot of work. I wear a lot of hats every day, whether it's working with our customers, the OEMs, dealing with issues with manufacturing. It's a fun thing.

Well, that's a cool spot, too. Are you going to keep any of the ice-shrink vibe here, or is that all going to go away?

So the floor, I'm going to keep. As you guys have seen, we've had a little bit of fun here.

You've already made it your own.

Yeah. So I definitely want to keep, I love the way it looks from the crank. It gives that automotive vibe. We've done quite a few burnouts in here. But no, I don't want to change it. I mean, are we going to update? Oh yeah, I can send you some good videos. I mean, I'm going to update lighting and stuff like that, just to bring it up to today's standards. But I don't really want to get rid of what this originally was because it's such a unique building.

It's really cool. For lack of a better word, vibe. Yeah. Like it's... I can only imagine how smoky it's gotten in here.

Yeah, that's kind of an understatement.

Well, I just wish you were telling me that the lights over there don't work out. It would be cool to have those strobing with the smoke.

They worked.

Okay.

For a minute. And then, when this was... Because it went from an ice rink to a roller rink. And so the computer that ran those was mid-90s. And like, it worked, but I think when we were doing electrical and like killed power, it fried the computer. And so now it's like, they were cool, but I mean, now with today's, you know, I want to get a few disco ball and a few laser lights and this will be even better.

Yeah, that'd be cool.

There's some Go-V lights in here, do everything from your phone.

Yeah.

Yeah.

When you were working with the designers and stuff at Stellantis and you're, do you guys have designers on staff too? Like, do you bring some of your guys' touch to a lot of that stuff too when you're doing that?

Yeah. So it's cool because like, I'll get, so like working with their designers, like they'll send us like renderings and designs. And then through our technology with our printers, we'll, I'll kind of add our touch to it. And so one of the things that I've figured out over the last few years is how to 3D print graphics to make them textured and create cool designs. Like we've, you know, I've 3D printed like a wood graphic and it looks and feels like wood. And so, and there's been graphics that we've done with some of like the SEMA concepts to where it'll be 3D printed on there. So you can actually go up and like, you know, feel it. And like it's almost like embossed, but it's printed in.

Okay.

Oh, cool.

And then like, you know, it's been done a lot with like, kind of staying on top of like printing to where like, one of the unique things that our printers can do is print gloss and matte at the same time. And so like a lot of people within like, the graphics world will layer graphics. And I want to keep everything on one layer just because you end up with a better product.

Is that what you were working on, that like last piece, like the Helltreks piece?

Is that what that was? So that's actually going to go on Cletus' truck.

Okay.

It snowed in. That's gonna be cool.

Yeah.

And so that was an American flag, and we took the stripes and then changed them from gloss to matte.

That was really cool. And that's all just in one go, just on the printing side?

Yeah.

Wow. Okay. That's really cool, because that's one of the issues when we would do liverys on the rally cars. You would have to layer it. I think there was some Crown rally car that had like seven layers.

Yeah.

Just crazy.

Yeah. And so that's kind of the unique part of what we can do is, you know, a lot of it comes to the materials that you're using, because most of the time, like with a graphic, you print it and then laminate it. But if you get into, like we use a lot of UV technology. And so as a print's coming out, it's fully cured, ready to go and scratch-resistant. And so then we can run a little bit thicker material that'll hold up.

Okay. Do you have like a particular brand that you work with on that side, like 3M, Avery?

So we work from the wrap side, you know, real partial to like KPMF, Orgel, Avery, APA, use some 3M. And then on the print side, all of our stuff comes from a company called Substance.

Okay. Gotcha.

And so, yeah, I've been using them for the last 2 years, and it's honestly, I think, the best print material out there.

Okay. Do you want to touch on this event that you're going to or leaving for in like 2 days?

Snowden.

Yeah.

Yeah. So got invited to go to Snowden last year with Heltrax. And, you know, like part of the event, you know, like I said, like not much of like a YouTube watcher, but I'm getting into that world, you know. I've been very fortunate to meet a lot of the YouTubers, influencers out there and collaborate with them. And now we're moving into that just because we're having a lot of fun. And so last year I got to meet Sparks and hang out with those guys and really hit it off. And so they invited us back this year and I'm actually bringing my own truck this year that we're going to debut the new set of Heltrax on. So we've got a single track and then we modified my TRX to make a thousand horse. So it should be pretty sweet. Yeah. Yeah. And it's an awesome weekend just because, you know, you've got, you know, like Heavy D, Diesel Dave, The Muscle, Whistlin Diesel, The Seaboys, Cletus, I think Grind Hard. There's a bunch of people. I think there's like 40 something people going. We all pile into a cabin and literally just go all out all weekend with the craziest ideas we can come up with. And I'm super pumped for it just because like, you know, we don't get that experience here in Michigan like we do out there to go play in the mountains with the ultimate snow toy.

Yeah.

And so I'm super, super excited about that. And to bring some of my guys up.

There's helicopters involved and all kinds of stuff.

Yeah, got my, last year got my first ride in a helicopter and it was a Blackhawk and that didn't suck.

Yeah, I bet not.

And Dave knows how to fly that thing. And we did some mountain carving and that was absolutely incredible. And really...

What a first experience, by the way, in a Blackhawk, right?

Yeah, no, it's like, you know, you're thinking like, oh, like, I've always wanted to go on one and then I just went to the top. Yeah. And I tell everyone, there is nothing like it. Like the power that that thing has, how fast it goes, how fast it climbs is, it's on another level. And yeah, I mean, who knows what else is coming this weekend. I know there's a bunch of toys coming and like, it's got a key in it, drive it.

Really?

Yeah. And so it should be a good weekend. And who knows what else we're going to get up to. So it should be, videos probably coming next week.

Right.

Yeah.

So when you're doing, when you go out there, is any like set, set objective or not really? Just have fun. Yeah.

And come up with bad ideas.

Yeah.

Well, with a group like that, there's gonna be plenty of bad ideas.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. It's a, you know, it's, hey, let's build a jump and jump something. Let's, you know, it's, it's endless. Like it's the creativity of the whole group comes together and it's like, oh, let's do this and let's do that. And so it's gonna be literally three days of just madness.

Yeah. Just kind of, yeah. Have you ever been out to the sand dunes out here? Have you ever done any filming out there?

Yeah. Yeah. So I've been going to Silver Lake for, since high school.

Okay.

Grew up riding quads out there and then dirt bikes. And then when I got into the whole, got my first jeep, of course, go to Silver Lake. This past year, we took a ram out there with Peltracks on it to see what it was like in the sand, which was incredible. There's a, one of the really cool things we did out there is there's a pond out there that just, people try to go through that just eats vehicles. And we just drove the truck right through it. No issues. Worst smelling thing on the planet, but it was just so cool. But like people saw what we were doing. And like all of a sudden the crowd just started piling in and just drove right through it. And, but no, I love Silver Lake. It's kind of like a Michigan staple.

Yeah.

And, but now it's like, all right, I've done that. Now it's like, all right, let's go to Glamis. Never been there and definitely want to do that. Just got to build something for that because that's on another level.

Yeah. You've been out to like Moab and stuff like that too.

Yeah, so I've been doing Moab for a few years now. Usually got with the Jeep brand. Just wanted to see the vehicles that we worked on them with, and then to have fun with my own rides. So one of the things I've been doing when I go out to Moab is the group that comes with me. I try to bring some people who have never been off-roading before and let them drive my Jeeps. Just because it's hard to explain off-roading to someone who's never been. Sure, there's the trails around Michigan, but that's nothing compared to what you're going to see in Moab. And the technicalities of it, and just what you're doing, and there's some trails you make a mistake, the Jeep goes bye bye. And no, it was fun. We did a really cool trail ride this past year, Moab Rim, and got a group together. And I'm like, oh, we're going to go do this trail. We're going to kick it off at 10 o'clock at night. Really didn't tell anyone where we were going, it was Moab Rim. And got on the trail and people are looking at me like, are we going to die? Because like it's a pretty like, if you've never done it before, it will stress you out a little bit. But everyone had capable jeeps. I probably had the hardest jeep to drive at the time. I was driving a built Wagoneer with a manual, like a 392 and a manual. And there were some pucker moments. But it was super fun taking everyone through it. And when we got, I think we started at 10, got to the top, and by the time we got back down, it was probably 4 o'clock in the morning. And the best part was with that group, at the end, everyone was like, that was the coolest thing I've ever done. Super thankful, I had some great guides with us. And those are experiences you never forget. I love being able to show people those experiences, because then you might have another enthusiast and somebody wants to get into that. Because I would say, like automotive is my passion, but I love off-roading. It's just, it's something so different.

Yeah, when you say Wagoneer, you mean like the classic one?

Yeah, it was a, so I worked with, so it was a SEMA build from two years ago with my buddy Trent's company called Carbuff. And so we came together, an incredible amount of partners and our group at Carbuff, and we did a full restoration. And there was a shop out in Utah, Resurgence Automotive, where the vehicle was at. And then everyone kicked in parts and whatever we could. I provided the 392, did the graphics, 3D printed a bunch of parts for it. And we all came together, unveiled it at SEMA, and then it traveled around the country and then got to Michigan. And so I brought it to some shows around here and then brought it to EJS and wheeled the hell out of it.

Yeah, well, that's cool. How often do you see a built Wagoneer for that 392?

Yeah, it's kind of that year. So yeah, two years ago, it stole the show there. Like, everyone was like, you're wheeling this thing? And I was like, yeah. It's fully capable. I mean, there was nothing on that Jeep that wouldn't allow it to be. I mean, did it look like a show car? Sure. But it was fully capable. And that's what it was built for. It was built to, yes, you know, be a beautiful vehicle. But, you know, Trent wanted it to be a off-road capable vehicle. It wasn't meant to go sit in the corner. It's meant to be a driver.

Are you big on that, driving your cars?

Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, I've got a few toys. And, you know, like my 18 Demon, all right, perfect example. I beat the living hell out of that car. You know, it's been through, I'd call it, we're on like the third version of it, you know, going from stock, actually fourth version, going from stock, then to like E85, pulleied, and then we twin-turboed it. And then we did for Roadkill, we did the Hurricane swap. And that's where it sits right now. And then, you know, we'll run it through that. You know, we want to, of course, modify that motor, get into the tuning of it. And then from there, I'll probably make it a full drag car. So I'll go back to a big V8, turbos again, and fully cage it and kind of make it my drag car.

Why Hurricane swap it?

I was just going to ask that. Whose idea was that?

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Well, so, my buddy Garrett who, American Muscle HD on Instagram.

He's a cool dude.

Yeah. And so when he got invited to Roadkill, like, you know, he wanted us to build the car. And like we were going back and forth on ideas. Like initially we're like, oh, let's put it in a Jeep. Like no one's done that yet. That'd be super cool. I've got all the parts we can think of and it'd be a real easy build. And then, you know, Dodge really wanted us to use a Plymouth or Dodge vehicle. And so I'm like, we kept going back and forth on ideas. And you know, times getting shorter and shorter of when the event was. And one morning I was just like, just use my Demon. Like I know the car super well. It's been through a lot already. So, and I was getting ready to pull the motor anyways, just cause we wanted to redesign the turbo kit and I was like, screw it. And that's what we did. And you know, like everyone thought I was crazy for doing it, but everything that we did is reversible. So, it's not like, you know, we've ruined the car. Like I could put it completely back to stock, no problem. Right. But, and we wanted something that was like, that would stand out, you know, kind of be the head-turner. And then also, you know, like kind of like you would piss people off. Like why did you use a Demon? And it's like, well, I had the car. And, you know, like, could we have got another car? Sure. But like, that was the whole point was, you know, stir the pot, get people like, oh, it's got to have a Hemi. But the Hurricane is a, it's sweet. I mean, it's got a, like, it's got a sweet setup. It's got a ton of potential. It's just, we got to get it there. And so, you know, being one of the first people to have that was, the crate motor was awesome, but now digging into it is kind of the next step. You know, we acquired a few more Hurricane motors, and that's where we want to kind of go in and then see what the potential is, because there's a lot there.

Well, currently, you guys already did some dyno numbers with it as well, right?

Yep.

And did you say that was on JB4?

No, so the tune that we got for Roadkill is a modified tune. And so, we think at the wheel, we made 520, 540, I don't remember off the top of my head. Which is, I mean, like from, like if you look at like a Grand Wagoneer, the 1500 RHO, they're 550. And so, if we're making that the wheel, that shows that sort of there. But also, we were data logging the whole thing. And, you know, there's time that we get, there's fuel that we can add, so there's a lot there. We just gotta, just been busy. And so, now we gotta take that next step of seeing what it's capable of. You know, if we grenade the motor from putting, you know, too much power to it, or it is what it is. But at least we know where it's at. But it's, you know, it's where Stellantis is at right now. And that's, you know, what we gotta play with. And so, you know, do we have a lot of fun with all the Hemi cars? Absolutely. But this is something that it's the new thing that's out. And, you know, people are buying those cars. So let's dig into it. You know, it's like the RHO. I mean, the RHO, like I have my TRX. I got to go to the media drive for the RHO. So I drove my truck there, did the media drive, had a blast in the truck, got back in my TRX, and I was like, I'll take the RHO. Like, it feels lighter. The way it puts the power down, it's awesome. And the price point is way better, too. And so it's just, I think from that, like, you know, Hemi crowd, it doesn't make the sound. No. But is it a kick-a** product? Yeah. It's just people need to drive it and then understand it. You know, my Wagoneer's got a Hurricane in it, and I absolutely love it. Had zero issues with it. And, you know, I wouldn't, like, I got nothing bad to say about it. Like, it's a sweet setup.

It's hard to argue with that in Line 6 anyway. It's kind of been a tried and true thing. Yeah.

I mean, look at all the BMWs.

Yeah. It's a platform amongst, it's been putting down some crazy s*** for a while anyway, amongst other automakers. So it's, I think even back to the like 200 straight six that used to come in F250s and s***, those, you couldn't kill those things. It just kept going and going and going. So are they a lot lighter? Yeah.

I think the, that engine shaved like, don't comment on this, but like, I know like we weighed the car before and after, and you know, we added some carbon and stuff, but I think we shaved like 800 pounds on the car.

That's insane.

Yeah. I mean, it was impressive. Yeah. I mean, I like, you know, just for like the roadkill part of it, like I was like, all right, well, we know this thing's a boat. So like what are some things we can light up quick? So we got rid of the hood, and then I put carbon doors on it from Anderson. And I think the doors, they weigh like 57 pounds, and the Anderson doors weigh like seven.

Wow.

But I mean, that's still dry carbon. Like we just added the windows back in, but still not, you're not putting a lot of weight back in. Put a carbon decklet in, roof, but there's a lot there. It's just so new that getting into tuning it, like there's still that roadblock that everyone's trying to get past. And then turbos, fueling.

It's a crazy platform. So my dad demos a Wagoneer currently, and my brother just gasses it. It is ridiculous. I think it's like just under half a second slower, zero to 60 than the Escalade V.

Really?

Yeah, and we're talking about a car that makes 150 horsepower more or whatever. It's awesome.

The tow is great too. I've towed this in an enclosed trailer.

My buddy towed his twin turbo viper down to Texas with his Wagoneer. It was like the obsidian, whatever. They're nice.

Yeah.

Get tinted and everything.

Tears are awesome. I love the car.

So you have a number of partners on the Hurricane Demon. One of them is HP Turbo Chargers.

Yep.

So how did that all happen? I guess because you guys are marketing for them, I guess.

Yeah. It's another part of our business. Yeah. So I actually got introduced to HPT through Alex, whose truck's right there. So he runs HPTs on his twin turbo F150. And I think through him just posting on it through social, he got connected with them. And then he's like, here's the contact. And that's kind of, I wrote an email of what we're doing, and they were super happy to partner with us, and kind of built a relationship from there. So we're working on stuff for the Hurricane platform, but also for some of my other kind of in-house shop builds.

Well, it's going to be cool to be one of the first to be kind of pushing that too. That's one of the things I said from the get-go. I can't wait till people start modifying the Hurricane.

We've been keeping an eye on it for a while.

And I think it was just getting to the vehicle people wanted to modify. And so I think that's where a lot of people were kind of like, you know, the Wagoneer crowd isn't going to really modify that. And so and then, you know, then it came out in the Ram 1500. And now that it's in the RHO, you're hitting a different demographic that's going to spend more money on modifying it because look how many people have modified their TRXs. And so now it's, you know, and what they've done with the piggyback, I mean, it's making more power than the TRX now, which is don't get me wrong. Like I love that truck, but it sucks filling that thing up. That's probably the worst part of it is like every other day.

Well, it's not even a huge tank in there either, if I remember correctly.

Yeah, it's not, it's got a smaller tank than the 1500, because I think like in the 1500, you can get like a 30 gallon tank or something. And I want to say it's like 22, 23 gallons.

Yeah, something goofy like that.

Yeah. And I mean, you can blow through that in a second. I mean, I think I average like nine miles a gallon in mine. Well, now it's even going to be worse. Because now that we switched blowers, did upper and lower pole, these injectors, E85. So now it's going to be probably hot garbage. But, you know, thousand horse, way more fun.

Yeah. For in between gas stations.

Pretty much.

So why Jeep, right? Before you had this whole relationship, why did you love Jeep so much beforehand? Is that kind of where your love started or?

So no, actually.

Okay.

So kind of a love for cars came from my grandmother.

Okay.

And so my grandparents are from Italy. And so they would split time between here and Italy. And every year, my grandmother, when they came back, she would bring me a model Lamborghini. And so that's kind of the poster on the wall. And so I really like that was the thing I always looked forward to was getting that model. And that's kind of what got my interest in cars. But like never was truly in the industry till after college. And no, just always kind of wanted to get into it, but just, you know, never, you know, growing up, like never had the money to really modify cars or anything like that. And I was up north on a camping trip with a bunch of buddies. And I think we were at McDonald's, like in the drive through McDonald's. And I saw two jeeps covered in mud. And I was like, that looks like a lot of fun. And literally, I think within a week, my wife and I went and bought a jeep. And from there, like I just started modifying it. You know, it didn't really like know a whole lot about that side of the industry. But I kind of went all into it. And that's really where it started. And so I got a, would have been a 2012 JK. And like literally cost me everything I had at that time. And that's kind of what kicked it all off. And through kind of like my network in Detroit, got introduced to the guys at AEV and started putting all their parts on and then kind of went from there. And you know, never thought when I got my first jeep, I'd be working with the brand. Like that's the wild part. And that kind of really started it. And then, you know, and then from there, you know, that's where kind of where I really got into it, was helping kick off M1 Concourse.

Do you want to tell us a little bit about M1 Concourse?

Yeah.

And how that whole project happened?

Yeah. So I mean, it feels like a lifetime ago. So back before I was kind of in the whole automotive scene, I had a personal training company. And so in one of my clients, we would literally like, you know, he was a car enthusiast, so was I. And I was like always like tinkering with cars on the side and, you know, just doing what I thought I could do from like modifications. And we would always go back and forth on, you know, like no one has owned the like Motor City scene of cars. And he was doing some research and saw the complex, Auto Motorplex, that's up your guys' way. Yeah, and saw that and we're like, we need to do that in Detroit and talked about it, talked about it, talked about it. And, you know, we were kind of just like, got to find property, this or that. And I was driving up Woodward one day and I saw the property in Pontiac where M1 is and I was like, that's it. It's on Woodward, you know, saw the sign up, you know, I was like, let's do it. And I mean, it took us three, I think we were working on for like three years, you know, just going through acquiring the property. Because it was an old General Motors plan, so it was remediation for the property. But, you know, like one day, you know, he was, he's like, all right, leaving my job, I left mine, and we put everything into it. And like when we were pitching the idea to, you know, people are on, you know, all your automotive enthusiasts, they thought we were absolutely insane. But once, you know, people caught on that we were serious and really going with it, I mean, we pretty much sold, I think in nine months, we sold the whole first phase out. And then we kicked off construction.

How many, is it like units over there? How many units did you guys have?

Like, I think they're in total now, there was, in total, I think there's 250 plus.

Wow, okay.

And so, so the whole place sold out. But it went from just doing like, so initially it was like the garage condo concept. And then it turned into, let's put a track there. And then put the event center in. And so it was kind of an evolving thing. And so, you know, once we got all that going, broke ground, then people understood that we were serious and pretty much the rest of it sold itself. And then, you know, kind of once, you know, I helped with construction and then once we actually opened a facility, I kind of oversaw the facility, the events, helping create events, and, you know, the coolest event that we did was Roadkill Nights. And so, it was cool working with Motor Trend. Had to work with the, you know, state of Michigan with MDOT, City of Pontiac, and, you know, building an event to close down Woodward and build a drag strip and then tear it down all in 48 hours, that was wild. And the first year we did it, it was, you know, like, it was wild, like crazy trying to do it all. But as you can see, it's, you know, it's been going since. And it's cool, you know, I've raced in it countless times, you know, being in the garage match this year was super cool. And yeah, you know, it's kind of like, it's one of those things I look back on and I was like, that was fun creating all that. And just, you know, like, again, being involved in the community and, you know, like, that's what I love doing is just, you know, getting people into automotive.

Are you still involved with the track now? Are you, other than like Roadkill Nights and stuff, are you?

Yeah, so, no, I separated 2017, 2018, and that's just wanting to kind of move into my own thing. I was just between hours, like, and life, you know, you gotta, like, pick and choose your battles. And so I was like, kind of want to do something on my own. And here we are.

Yeah.

And so, and, you know, and from there, like, you know, but, like, the experiences were incredible. Meeting all, like, CEOs of companies was awesome. Like, the networking was, you know, that's the coolest thing about the network that I built from it. And then just through all the drive-in instructing I got to do, and then now, you know, I do stunt driving and, like, high-performance driving education. And it's fun as hell. Like, and when I get a phone call to go stunt drive, I'm like, yeah, I'm in. Like, what are we doing?

So are these, what are you stunt driving for? Is it like when you see these Dodge commercials or some?

Yeah, so I've done stuff with, like, countless brands. The most work I've done is with, been with Dodge Jeep. And, you know, and then I got to do the, I got the phone call to do the Grand Tour. That was a, that was a fun one. Got referred by one of the guys that I worked with, and I'm one at the time. He's like, oh, you got to talk to Matt. He has all the connections in the city. And he's like, this company called Chum Productions is going to reach out to you. And I was like, all right. And I was like sitting there, and I'm like, is this really going to happen? And so I'm sitting there, look up Chum Productions, and I was like, holy s***, this is the Grand Tour. And I was like, that's sweet. So one of the producers of the show called me and was like explaining what they wanted to do. And they pitched me the idea for that show. And I was like, that's not a good idea for coming to Detroit. I was like, the demon's out now. I'm like, we're in the renaissance of the ultimate horsepower cars. And so I came back to them and I'm like, let's do high horsepower Motor City cars. And I'm like, I've got some connections and they'll probably bite. And so I'm like, let's, you know, I was fortunate enough to get, you know, the original Demon. And I was like, let me make a phone call to someone at Dodge. And I guarantee you, they'll be in. Made the phone call and I'm like, they're in. And so I put all the pieces together. And then I, you know, then the show evolved. Cause like, I think they wanted to do like some old junker cars and like...

Right. Like a historical sort of piece?

It was like something like that. Like I don't, I, you know, don't remember exactly. And then, you know, all of a sudden now like Dodge was in and then Ford came in with the RTR Mustang and then Hennessey brought the Exorcist. And then it was cool. Like cause they're like, hey, you know, like we want to build a racetrack at this old, I think it was Cadillac stamping. Like we want to build a racetrack there. And so like, can you go down there? You know, you've done like safety and stuff at tracks and like, can you help us build a track? And I was like, yeah. So I went down there and I'm looking at this place like, this is going to be a lot of work.

All right, Dan, on a scale of one to 10, how much do you think your wife loves you?

Oh, it's got to be like an eight, solid eight.

So I think it would be great if she used your credit card to go to ToonBySean, shawn.com to get you a Haltech ECU for 5% off using cobalt oxide. Is that math out?

Absolutely.

Just because like it was run down and I'm sitting there like looking, because like, oh, we want to drive through, you know, the factory and everything like that. And I'm like, we're going to have to pave this. Like we're going to have to take sections out and pave it. And you know, I relayed that and they're like, just do it. And I'm like, all right, you know, I'm sitting there, I'm like, this isn't going to be a cheap bill. And so went in there, brought one of my buddies, paving companies in, like brought in cats and everything. We cleaned everything out and literally built that track. That's cool. Yeah. And it was super cool. And, you know, I got to be on set the whole time, helping them with, you know, anything they needed, like kind of like stunt related. I got to work with their stunt drivers, just with whatever they needed. And it was, I mean, it was, I think, like from like when I started to from finishing up filming, I mean, I was working with them for like four or five months just to set up for a week shoot.

Did the city and everything okay with you guys ripping stuff up and paying and stuff? Was that?

Yeah. So like, that's the thing. Like, you know, when you're bringing in big production companies, you got to pull the permits and everything. So yeah, we had to pull permits there, health and safety. So like, it wasn't a cheap thing. And but yeah, like, you know, like there's, there's guys in like every city that kind of do the setup and like they go like, you know, look at all, do all the recce at the locations to look at everything. And so I was working with those guys just to figure out like all the logistics and yeah, like when they roll into town, I mean, police escorts everywhere. And I would like it, it was super smooth.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What were we even talking about before all of this?

Grand Tour or yeah, yeah, Grand Tour, I think we were still on that, right?

Pave in the streets.

Yeah, like pave in the track. It was almost pretty much wrapped up.

Well, what was it like working with the cast? Did you get to meet them as well?

Oh yeah.

And so it was super cool. So like when we'd wrap filming for the day, like, hey, we're gonna go to the restaurant, have dinner and hang out. And so that's what we did kind of every night was we'd all have dinner as a group together. And those guys are hilarious.

Really?

Yeah. Like they're just, they're funny as s***. Like they are nonstop with the jokes. And like a lot of the stuff like that's, you know, that they're doing like while recording is just ad-lib. Like they'll just come up with it on the spot. You know, like Clarkson's like the mastermind. Yeah. But like they're just nonstop. And like, you know, like a lot of people started figuring out like that I was working with them. And so like my phone where you guys are like, I can't tell you.

Right. Well, I think you made like one Facebook post about it.

Yeah, I mean, I made a handful because like a lot of it, I waited until the show dropped.

Yeah.

And so just because, you know, courteous.

Did you have issues with that as you're doing things like that, as people like figuring out what's going on and like, did they get people mobbing in there?

Not really. So like when we'd go to like different sections of town, like it would like the police would block the streets off. And so like we went to like there's the portion where like they bought the house.

Yeah.

And so like it was great. Like the neighbors came out and stuff, but like they were just wondering what was going on. Like I think one of the neighbors like gave us chairs to use. And but other than that, like there wasn't really any issues because like there was the one where we did when we, I think it was when the RTR was racing the Hennessey Exorcist. Like that was down, I think, it was down in Grand River. So that was a little bit of a headache just because like, you know, you just have people walk and all of a sudden, you know, you've got a live shoot going on, we're drag racing.

Yeah.

And so but...

Well, yeah, I saw a video on YouTube of some random guy like filming you guys and that got thousands of views. Yeah.

And so like there was that Detroit City Airport that was shut down. So you don't have to worry about that. When we were doing in one of the old parking garage, like that was closed. So like it was, you know, again, everything was kind of like, you don't get past a certain point. So there's never really any issues.

How about like, so like, were you in charge of like picking like the theater, for example?

No, so the, why am I blanking on what these guys are called? Like the fixers. And so like they had people who would come out and scout all the locations. And so they would do it. And then we would kind of like, you know, they'd have me like, hey, can you like help get some of this equipment or whatever? And so that's, I also helped with that. Just, you know, cleaning up stuff and trying to just make everything as safe as possible.

Well, didn't the demon also go airborne or like get...

Yeah, so when we were doing the track, they're like, we want to jump a vehicle. And I'm sitting there and I'm like looking at a spot and I'm like, I'm pretty sure that will work. And, you know, I tested it beforehand. It worked really well. And that's kind of where that happened. And so, you know, one of the things were like, you know, like what are the speeds that we can go without sending a car too far? And luckily from, because it was coming out of the factory, it was a turn. And then it was kind of like up that ramp. And so there really wasn't a whole lot of speed you could carry. So it ended up being just fine. But it was sweet seeing the demon off the ground.

Yeah. Well, it's just such a big car too.

Yeah. Well, what is, what is, like, what's Dodge's expectation at that point? Like when you're doing something like that and they give you a car to use. Don't crash it. Jump it, but don't crash it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

All right. That was pretty much it.

Okay.

Did the others have any crazy, well, I guess RTR, that's not directly with Ford, is it? Or was it?

No. So that car, I think, came directly from RTR. Okay. And then Hennessy brought it.

Right.

And he was up the whole time too.

Okay.

And so, but they would bring like, there were teams there that were like, in case something did break, like we could fix the car real quick. But I honestly didn't have any issues with anything. So I mean, the extras though, because where they were stored for overnight, when that thing would start up, it was like deafening. It was like, don't get me wrong, like I love a loud car, but like it was like piercing. Yes. And, but it was cool. Like, you know, and like the final race, the demon versus the extras at the airport. And I mean, like the demon kicked the s*** out of the extras every single time. And so that was cool seeing that.

Well, yeah, I mean, that whole episode, that was one of the coolest episodes. One of my favorite parts of that episode is just how tiny Hammond looks next to the demon.

Yeah, yeah, he's not a very big guy.

Well, no, it's not even that. The demon is just huge. Like even next to the GT here, it's like the roof line is at the door line.

Yeah. So one of the, no, it's over. It's one of the coolest parts of the show. The thing that I always laugh about. So when they were doing the race at the airport, they forgot to film Hammond, Hammond touching the high octane button. So they called me and they're like, hey, can you film that? So it's actually my hand. Really? Pressing it. Yeah. That was kind of cool.

So did you have any other fun interactions during that whole, because you said it was like four or five months sort of deal? Yeah.

So I mean, for them, it was just like a lot of email interactions and then working on the site to get everything set up. But mainly, it was a few days before the crew flew in and just connected with those guys. And then once they hit the ground, it was filming every day. And so, but yeah, the interactions like on set, just kind of let them stay in your lane, let those guys do their thing. And then like after we're done filming, that was kind of when we hung out and just b******* and talk cars.

How long are they in town for when they're filming?

They were in town for like a week. And so it was like in film out. Like the day that we were at, next day they were out of town.

Yeah, that makes sense.

Yeah, because I think it's like the way they set it up, it's doing all the episodes and you just don't realize what goes into each episode and how much time it takes to set all that up, which was crazy.

Well, even like the behind the scenes, like on the YouTube video I saw, it's like the slow roll and everything, like the stunt drivers are backing up, getting ready for everything. It's a lot that goes into even a 10 second clip.

Oh yeah, and just reset it back up, shoot it again, getting different angles. That was like just to set up all the camera cars. That was the only thing I had to do. I had to help them source all the camera cars, but also it's been cool because a lot of the guys who are on the Russian arm, I've worked with them before. And so it's cool seeing those guys that I've worked with previously on set. And it's just a lot. There's so many moving pieces. Yeah, I mean, overall, one of the... Daisy. I know, you just want to say hi. You're such a good girl. No, experience of a lifetime. And I got paid, which was cool.

Even better.

You guys, did they put you on an hourly thing, or you just kind of like just give you a... I just build them.

Yeah, I mean, and it's like because I had to bill for... I helped source the cars they used for the camera cars, helped sort the paving. There was a lot to it. And they're like, yeah, just itemize it and send us a bill. And they paid me within 48 hours. And I was like, that was awesome.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's not frequent.

No, no. That's the thing is like, I'm like, this is not a small bill. Just with everything I was doing.

That's that Amazon money.

That's that Amazon money. Yeah, that was wild.

Whose idea was it to do the RTR and the Exorcist?

I think that once I got the idea with them, I think they took it from there once I got Dodge on board.

We find comparables.

Yeah, and that's where it all came together.

Which they didn't really have anything at that time frame because the GT500 wasn't out yet. And then I don't think the ZR1 was out yet either. So there was really nothing. Camaro was the ZL1, but that was nowhere near the Demon. Yeah. So that's why they had to do the Exorcist.

And it worked out perfectly because when the Demon launched, and then Hennessey put out the Exorcist, it all kind of came together.

It was a little bit of a story, yeah. You know, as a friend.

Hi, sweet pea.

I haven't seen the episodes, and I'm going to have to go back and watch it.

We'll throw it on tonight at the hotel.

What's... You said they bought a house too while they were here?

Yeah.

Just a rundown house.

Yeah, they bought a rundown house. I mean, it doesn't show Detroit in the best light.

Right, right.

But, you know, like, look at now, from then to where Detroit is now is incredible.

Yeah.

They also talked about it in the episode too, like saying, like, oh, like, it's on, like, the comeback.

Yeah, because, like, I think, if I'm not mistaken, like, it opens up, like, after, like, the montage, like, it opens up with, like, the vacant land that's turned into farms.

Yeah.

And so...

It also says turning vegan or something like that too.

Yeah, I think they...

Yeah.

And then that's where he slid the car through the garden.

Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we're going to have to watch that episode tonight. That was a fun time. Well, it's a great episode. And, like, again, I grew up Dodge, right? So, like, the demon was dropped. I was... Every day, I was checking the website as I was dropping, too. So, besides, like, obviously, you did the Jeep thing. Did you have a love for Dodge as well at that point? Or not really?

So, a lot of that came from when I started M1, and I helped... I got the deal put together for, like, for Dodge to be one of the first car manufacturer partner. And that was, you know, just after the Hellcat rolled out. And so, it worked out great. And so, when they provided us the vehicles, they provided us a few Hellcats and Vipers. And once you start driving those every day, you're like, okay, these are awesome. Yeah, I mean, like, what more... There's not a... You know, at that time, there wasn't a car out there that was as fun as a Hellcat. You know, you can go, you know, fast as hell and then drift it. The car was awesome. But then also, they're like, oh, here's two ACR Vipers.

Yeah.

And ripping those around the track daily was insane. Like, that's kind of the... That's the next car that I really want.

Yeah.

You want to grab a Viper at some point?

Yes. I don't care. Like, if it can be a junk... As long as it runs, because I just want to beat the hell out of it.

Yep.

Any particular gen?

Gen 5.

Yeah.

Gen 5 ACR.

Okay.

Yeah. I mean, I've got thousands of laps in one and it's just... That was like... I just fell in.

Thousands. Yeah, I guess.

Wow.

Yeah. That's a lot of track time.

You've taught HPDE then too? Yeah? Okay.

Ran a lot of track days. Still do. So, I'll work with companies out there where they want to do private track days and they'll bring me on from the track day.

You still do that then?

Oh, okay.

Yeah.

Just do a handful a year. Mainly it's for clients that I already have and just kind of keep it going. It's because one, it's a great day away from the shop. You just go rip cars around.

Yeah.

Have you ever done any like filming there as well? Of any kind?

From like, what kind of standpoint?

Whether it's for 5 O Clock Garage or anybody else.

Like track days?

Yeah, track days are just like any sort of track events at M1.

Not since like I left. I mean, I've done like some filming out there. Like we've done some drifting promotional stuff. Like there was stuff that we did for SEMA. And other than that, you know, I'm all over the country now. And so that's kind of where we do our filming.

True. Yeah. Yeah. Cause now you're again, what, going to Utah this week, just all over the place.

Yes.

Yeah.

And so, so yeah, you know, it's just kind of like, you got to pick and choose like, you know, what events I want to go to, what cars we're taking. And then also like, is there, like there's opportunities everywhere for events. And it's just between running this and then events. Like I got to pick and choose what events I want to go to. Are they meaningful to the business?

Right.

So like this one, yes, of course. Like for me, it's, you know, it's one, the networking is awesome, but two, just like having, you know, my truck out there, our graphics and all the vehicles, like.

Yeah, I can't wait to see that.

It's going to be awesome.

Yeah. And it's just, and you know, I've become friends with a lot of those guys over the past few years. And so it's just also having fun with your buddies.

He just wants to go for the helicopter rides.

I do love the helicopter rides.

It's like, I want to be in that Blackhawk again. How I used to look at like ride alongs, like, you know, at cars, at car meets, is how you look at helicopters and you're like, oh, I want that one.

I would love to have a helicopter. Yeah.

We've got your helicopter spiel.

That is like, that is the next goal, is I want a helicopter.

So obviously you've gone to turn some corners with the Viper then. How does that compare to the GT then? And what's the story with the GT?

Two totally different animals. I mean, this is like pretty much a race car without a roll cage. The Viper is raw American muscle. And so like the crazy part about like an ACR Extreme is just how far you can push that car. And it's just, it hooks and goes. Where this, you know, like I'm going to go drive a Viper, you know, when we had those Viper, I would drive them ten-tenths. You know, like when I drive this, like, yeah, no. You know, like this is, you know, a million and a half dollar car. And so, is it, you know, a great thing to drive and have fun with? Sure. But it's not like, you know, when I drive this or my other Demon, like I beat the hell out of them. You know, like this I can fix, that you can't. Okay.

You care a little bit more about this one then?

Well, yeah, you know, it belongs to a business partner. And it's like, yeah, I'm going to take care of that. But like all the stuff that I have, like whether it's my Jeeps, Demons, Trucks, like, yeah, I like it, you know, I want to have fun with it. And, you know, and it's cool because I have gotten a lot of industry partners that provide parts for these vehicles. And so, you know, put them to the limits, test them. You know, if something breaks, let's go back to that manufacturer and say, hey, this is what broke. And they want to know just like, how did it happen?

Right. Yep. Well, that's kind of a cool thing. You can just go up the street and be like, hey, here's what broke. How did it happen?

That's it. And there's so many manufacturers in Detroit that we work with, that it's easy to give feedback to, too. And so, because, yeah, I mean, like my jeeps, I like, I mean, when I think came back from Moab, I've had dents in the doors. But like, other than that, like everything really held up. You know, like, since I, from where I started with, you know, my first jeep to where my jeeps are now, like, I get to work with some of the best, you know, manufacturers out there and, you know, they're tried and true parts.

Yeah.

And, yeah, you know, that jeep's been airborne. It's done some fun stuff.

Have you worked with any, so you got a pretty tight thing going on with Stellantis. Have you guys, have you done any partnering or working with any of the other OEMs?

I've done some work, but not like what I do with Stellantis.

Okay.

Just, you know, I've built a really good relationship with them over the past four years, and, you know, that's kind of where I'm at. And so, I, you know, it's not from working with, you know, product design to the marketing teams. It's a very, like, they're, I would say, they're the easiest OEM to work with. Like, you know, we come up with an idea, and they're like, yeah, we're in. Let's do it. Like, last year when I put the RAM 2500 on the Helltrak, so I was like, hey, can I get a 2500? And they're like, yeah, go pick it up. And went and picked it up, and we had to do Daisy. You know, I had to put a leveling kit on the front and then chop a little bit of rubber because we had never fit it before.

Best guard dog ever.

Yeah? Yeah. Come on, push hard.

I didn't eat my weenies today.

But no, like, so with the, like, you know, with that deal, like I was like, hey, you know, we might have to do some slight modifications, like, oh, can I go back to stock? And I was like, yeah, you know, I'm just going to need, like, I'll put another pumper on it, and I'll take the lift kit off, and we're good. But from their standpoint, they're like, this is sweet marketing material. And so, and then, you know, kind of started working on that side of things with some of the vehicles that we've built. They use it, you know, in social, and that's awesome to see, you know, them promoting our business, and then, you know, the world seeing everything that we do here.

Do you build, build cars for anybody who wants to come in here and do this? I mean, you, I think I've talked to you before, you do some stuff with some influencers and stuff, too, or big YouTubers.

Yeah, so we've got some influencers we work with. We've got some cool upcoming projects that I won't say yet, because they haven't been, no one's talked about them yet.

Redacted.

Yes. But no, I've got some cool projects coming up, that like there's multiple shops coming together for the build. I mean, like, Sparks just got his new AMW Gladiator, and I did all the custom graphics on it and stuff, so that's always cool to see. But there are some influencer builds that we're going to be involved with here in the next few months. And so it's just, I gotta get all this done first and then get back to the rest of the stuff.

This being the shop?

Yes.

Yeah, or the, what do you call this? Do you call this a shop?

The rink.

The rink?

Yeah, you know, still it's kind of like, it's what we call it, it's just kind of stock. It's not a rink anymore, but it still looks like one. Yeah.

So over the last, like, little bit more than a decade, I mean, is there any moment or anything that you've done that you're most proud of?

Oh, boy, I mean, like, first, like, one, you know, being a part of building M1, awesome, getting the Call of Earth Grand Tour, getting to film commercials at the OEMs, and then like seeing it on all the channels that they promote stuff on. I would say kind of the coolest thing that I've done, which was recently is we shot a TV show. Won't go into details yet. But yeah, we got to shoot a TV show back in September and really excited to see that rollout. And so that was kind of the, like the really fun one was to bring all the guys that helped me here out to the shoot and we did a build-off. And that was kind of like, all right, we're getting somewhere. Like, you know, like, you know, when you, you know, you literally like, blood, sweat and tears go into every business. Like when you're the owner, you wear so many hats every day. And then to do something like that and literally have fun the whole time you're doing it. That's kind of like one of the top things, you know. It's a lot of work running the business. Like, you know, when you're coming from, starting from nothing and then trying to build into something and then all the different hats you wear. It's a lot.

Yeah.

Well, so then that brings me to my next question. What's the hardest thing about doing what you do? Waking up another day.

It's just, you know, I think it's just dealing with growth, you know, bringing on more employees, bringing on more work, keeping everything in order. Like that's, you know, like you got to grow into that and just, you know, and then it's just like trial and error. Like, you know, like one day you might think you're doing the next, doing it right and then the next day you're like, well, that didn't work. And so, and just, you know, I think a lot of it's just being able to evolve. Like, you know, like learning from other people, asking people questions, like always being open to, you know, new ideas, listening to your peers. You know, there's a lot you can learn from people who are successful. And just having the right group around you is a lot. I mean, I think a year and a half ago, like my wife quit her job to come on board with us. We just called her the boss because, you know, just where she came from in corporate America and having her involved here, you know, it's like she keeps order. Just because like it's real easy to get off track in this world. So we want to go build this car and then, you know, but then you're taking a time away from the business. And yeah, that's, and you know, you got personalities at your shop, you got lives to deal with, you know, you got kids and it's just, you know, like putting a schedule together that where you can, you know, everyone's happy. Like it's, that's probably, that's probably one of the hardest parts is just time management. And just like, you know, trying to stay on top everything, not get behind. But also like, you know, like there's what we currently are manufacturing and making, and then it's being innovative too, like spending that time to like, what's the next cool idea? And so, and there's all, you know, it's just how do you split up your day? And, you know, it's focusing on like block of an hour here, two hours there, and just kind of staying with that. You know, I was the biggest thing that I've kind of taught myself as we've been growing, just staying in your lane. Like, you know, let's stick to what we're really good at. And then, you know, then, you know, have time set aside to for product development and marketing, social.

His ride's here.

Yeah. But yeah, it's, you know, it's just like, running a business is seven days a week. You know, just dealing with, you know, you got customers, like if there's issues with shipping and just resolving all that stuff, running a small business, you know. I would say it's not for everyone, but like, I would, the freedom, I think that even though I'd say I don't really have much, but the freedom gives me like, all right, I, you know, I need to take this time off, I just take it.

Yeah. That's one of the reasons that I'm able to do this with Harris is just because I own my own business, although I technically, I have a contract with somebody that, you know, I always say even though you have your own business, you don't technically work for yourself. You still have a customer or somebody who is, if you're not delivering, then you're going to get fired.

And just, and keeping all your employees on the same page, you know, like you got, you know, you got to keep everyone happy. But also like you want a team that's, you know, that's striving for the next milestone. And that's kind of the biggest thing, is just having that group that can cohesively work together that wants to take that next step. You know, like there's, I'd say there's a lot of people that want to work in automotive, but then they don't realize all the work it takes to work in automotive. And that's, it's a lot.

I can't remember who it was. I think it was like an NFL player that posted this like a week or two ago. Everybody wants to be a dog until they have to do dog s***. Or something weird like that. I don't know. Yeah.

Well, it's just, you know, like, I feel like some days I'm the janitor, you know, it's like you just got to clean, take care of s***, you know.

There's a couple of spills over there by the way, but that's not even here nor there.

And so, it's just wearing all those different hats and, you know, there's always going to be work you don't want to do. But like, then we do get over with it, like, all right, I feel really good.

So what is your ideas board consist of? I'm not sure if that white board I saw in there was the ideas board or not, but like, I'm sure you're constantly trying to figure out what's next. How do you decide on what's the next cool project? Does somebody come to you or is it in house?

You know, from like the automotive side, it's, you know, going to shows and seeing what people have created and then trying to like put our touch to it. Always staying on top of new cars, but then from like our print side, because we have machines that are capable of, you know, a variety of types of printing, is looking at markets that, you know, we can take a piece of and then, you know, then, you know, doing the product development, testing everything out and then seeing if it works. And then is there a market to where there's a return on it? And so, but that's kind of like why, like I shifted my shop to four 10s. And so then I used my Fridays for like R&D. So then it's like, we've got all of our work done and then I can spend time coming up with ideas, developing stuffs, seeing what our machines are capable of doing. And so we've spent, kind of like, I would say this is kind of our slower time of the year. But it's not. And so coming up with the different ideas of like, hey, like I haven't seen this product out there, let's create it. And then does it work? And yeah, that's what Fridays are for, R&D day.

Do you do anything with like 3D printing or modeling or anything?

So like in the 3D printing side, so like when we're developing parts for cars or like to want to modify stuff, you know, which you guys are going to talk to Alex tomorrow. Alex is a guru when it comes to 3D printing and stuff. So like, we'll come up with an idea for a project, and then literally next day he'll have a part ready. And then I work with another company called Azoth out of Ann Arbor. And so they specialize in all types of 3D printing. And so that's where I'll make the custom 3D printed Jeep shifter inserts. We'll 3D print badges, and we do it out of stainless steel. Or for certain high-end car builds, we'll make custom badging for it. And so we'll get the scans of the cars, and then make it so it looks like an OEM fit.

Do you have a 3D scanner here?

Yeah.

Okay, that's pretty cool.

Yep.

Okay.

And so I've got one, and then I've got a few buddies who got them.

Yeah.

And then a lot of times too, like there's certain stuff where we can get the CAD data for, and then we'll just adjust it from there.

Do you do anything with like SEMA Garage at all?

No.

Okay. I know they have a lot of those. You go directly to the OEMs.

Yeah. Well, SEMA Garage is an hour away from here. It's the Plymouth one. But no, I haven't used that resource because at a certain point where I'm just like, we've got everything, let's just do it right now.

Yeah, true. Yeah, fair enough. Is there anybody, because you have a good bit of business acumen. Is there anybody you go to mentorship for anything like that, or where does that come from?

I mean, I feel like a lot of the stuff I get is watching what a lot of my peer group does and ask questions, but also I feel like there's a lot of them from podcasts.

Okay. Anybody in particular?

It's like I love listening to just the variety of people that Rogan brings on, and then Andy Frisello runs that. So I love a lot of the stuff that Andy brings to the table. It's just older stuff, I'm guessing, most of it?

Yeah.

Just everything. I mean, it's just one of the things I'm always is just always be learning, evolving. Because a year from now, the world could change and it's like, how do we make sure that we're still at the top of our game? And it's trial and error. But I feel like I've got a pretty good peer group that I can always reach out to. And just meeting with what I'd call, there's a board that I'm a part of through Carbuff, it's called the CV7. And so it's a bunch of guys within the automotive industry and we meet twice a month. We do a Zoom call and we all talk about our businesses and where we need help, what else we could be thinking of. And so it's kind of like, that's kind of the one major peer group that I meet with. Just because everyone's going to have different issues where you might have experienced it before. And it's a very open group to where we can talk openly and discuss where our business is at.

That's pretty cool you can draw on that resource too. Yeah. Because you can see where you're lacking or where somebody else is just killing it. Yeah. Have you met Andy before or no?

Nope.

He's a b***** collection.

Yeah, he does.

That dude's got taste in ours.

I would love to meet that guy.

It's not often you hear somebody that relies on that as a resource.

Well, and it's cool listening to some of these podcasts where someone that they'll have on will have an issue. It could have been a similar issue too that I had. And I resolved it the same way that Andy could have said. And it's like, all right, so I've got the right mindset.

I'm doing it right, yeah. The amount of times I've said that, it's like, all right, cool, I'm on the right track.

Yes. Yep.

So then, oh, go ahead.

Well, what about your crew that we keep running India with? So people you're using to build here, is this just people you've met along the way, or companies you've reached out to for work, and then it's just personalities have jived, or they've done great work for you, and then it just kind of grows as a relationship from there?

Yeah, so I'd say the Detroit racing automotive community, we're a pretty tight-knit group, everyone kind of knows everyone, and it's just personality matching, and finding people with the same mindset of wanting to be successful, wanting to grow their business, and over the last, honestly, over the last year, we've all kind of come together, and we all want each other to succeed, and so wherever we can help, we help. And yeah, I mean, Alex, Nick, Ed, we all support each other. And so if it's like, hey, my shop is booked right now, do you have any open slots? And then feed each other work. And then it's also problem-solving. We all bounce around to each other's shops, and it's like, hey, can you come help me with this? Yeah, we're there. And then vice versa. Hey, I've got something I need to work on. And it just, we all kind of pay it forward.

Yeah.

Do you have any favorite trips that come to mind? For example, I saw one where you met, like, Shmee.

Oh, yeah. So I was down in Florida, working on some Porsches, and probably one of the most incredible car collections I've ever seen. It's called the Iconic Collection. And I was there working on a GT2 RS, a GT3 RS, and a GT3. And it just so happened that Shmee was there. And then one of his right-hand guys ended up having a mutual friend. And so we ended up talking. And that was really cool. I mean, that was, like, I would say, like, the trips just keep getting better, you know? Like, I've been to, like, a good chunk of, like, the shows that people want to go to. Like, you know, Car Week in Monterey, incredible. You know, we have Boardward here. Going to all, you know, we've all been to CIMA, PRI. So it's, I've been fortunate enough over the last four years to go all over the country, and now it's like, all right, now, you know, I think the next step for me would be, like, going to, like, Goodwood or something like that. Just, you know, it all comes down to time.

Well, that's a bucket list for me, is, like, I would love to do, like, a 10-day trip of, like, Goodwood and then go to the Silverstone race. That'd be cool.

I mapped it out.

I'm like, all right, we can rent a car from here, all right? Six-hour drive, we'll make it happen. So that's on the bucket list in the next decade, but...

Yeah, no, like, I'd say kind of, like, top of that, like, one of my bucket lists is going back to Italy and then hitting all the car factories.

Yeah, that'd be cool.

I haven't had a chance to do that yet.

We just had Schwartz Performance on, and he went out to the Pagani factory. I'm gonna go check that out. Just, it's a Mac ad. I actually know Antonio also went there. Yeah. Yeah, he visited. Just ridiculous. Have you ever been to Starstruck? Because you've met quite a few people. Will you ever strike me as someone who would get Starstruck?

Um, not really.

Yeah.

I mean, it's like- They're just people. Yeah, everyone's just people. It's just, you know, like, you don't want to be the fanboy. But no, like, it's putting everyone on the same level, and, you know, I don't want to disrespect anyone's time.

Right.

And then, you know, like, when you meet people and you click, like, it is what it is. And so, and it's fun. I've got to meet an insane amount of, like, celebrities, or automotive celebrities. And, you know, it's like, do you want to work with them?

Sure.

It's just, you know, figuring out the plan to put together for it all to make sense.

So one of the things we talked about before we started the show is you hate the word sponsor.

Yes.

Tell us a little bit about that.

Yeah. Well, it's just like, I mean, you know this across the automotive industry. Everyone's, you know, like, oh, I'm sponsored. And it's like, cool. Did you get, like, a discount on a part or like, I don't know. I hate the word. I feel like it's like, it's overused. So like, kind of one of the things that, you know, like our group has been working on is like, how do we evolve that into like a partnership brand ambassador? Like, you know, like, there's so many people out there just looking for a free part. But like, I'm looking for, like anytime we're doing anything, like I want a product that is like, that's, you know, well made. It's going to do what it needs to do. And then, you know, if I'm using that product, I want to be able to talk highly of those companies. And, you know, like I don't, like there's, you know, tons of people out there who brand hop just cause they're going to get free parts. Like, you know, my big thing is if I'm putting a proposal together for, you know, like a SEMA build or a marketing build, something like that, like, you know, I'm going to always hold my word to what we're doing. Like these are, like I try to lay it out, like these are the partners, these are the shows it's going to, this is the content we're going to create with it. You know, it's giving back, I want to give back 10 times what they're giving me. And so, it's the value that you can bring to the table and you know, and then like, you know, once I, you know, as I've started this and sort of working with companies, it's like, you know, I want to make sure like on the next project that, you know, they may have a part, like I want to use them and I want to be able to have that, hey, you know, I've got, you know, make, build that relationship to where I can call them up and say, hey, I've got this project, you know, like, I'll pay for it. Like, that's not the thing. But if you can deliver back, you know, way more than, they're like, no, like, here you go. Like, that's awesome. Like, I don't like, like, I don't want anything for free. I want to build a relationship to where, like, it's a trade-off. Like, you know, I'm going to market your company and then, you know, like, that cost comes back into the part. It's just like, I don't know, I feel like I can only imagine talking to some of my buddies who, you know, that work for manufacturers, like, you got to imagine, they're getting so many emails. And there's so many people out there just looking for free s***. And, like, I don't want to be that guy. Like, I want to be something that's going to give the, you know, that's going to make a sale for them, that's going to give them an outreach. Or if, like, they're developing a product and I can help them with it, like, yeah, I'm not going to turn that down. You know, like, how can I help, you know, you launch a new product? And just, or like, you know, it's cool, like, when a brand calls, hey, we've got this coming out, what you got to think you can use for it, and then it's like, well, maybe I can change this, and then we'll make that work.

Maybe I'll just get rid of my Demon motor, my twin turbo, and just put a Hurricane in there.

Yes.

Do you think that car will, well, I guess what's the next iteration of that car? Do you have any idea?

Yeah, probably a DSR motor.

A what?

DSR motor.

Okay.

It's a twin turbo. Okay. Yeah.

Do you enjoy it? Well, how does it compare to the 170?

I mean, well, this is the only one.

I mean, how does the 170 compare? Yeah.

I would say when I had the 18 Demon twin turboed, that car was unreal. I would say like we got it like 90% of the way there. Just a lot of it came down to just tuning, because it was like we built that car in like five days, just because we were getting ready for sick week. And so, and it was just between work and other projects. Like I never really got to fully finish it. That's why I was going to pull the motor out anyways, to really come up with the final version of it. And then the opportunity with Roadkill happened. I'm like, all right, let's put that, you know, that's where it's putting that in. But no, like once, you know, like, do I want to still like figure out what the limits of the hurricane are? Absolutely. And then once we're done with that, then we're gonna put a Hemi back in it.

So figuring out the limits, what's that gonna look like? I mean, are you able to do much with the ECU at the moment, or what?

Did they give you an ECU then, too, to, I mean, how did you get that thing to run in that short amount of time?

So yeah, so Mopar provided a MoTec ECU for it, but it's different than the factory car. So like the factory crate motors are coming with a Bosch ECU. And no one's in that yet.

Okay.

So they'll give you in a crate motor an ECU that will run it to its?

It's a locked ECU. Yeah, it's no different than when you go to HP Tuners and get your ECU unlocked and then you go from there.

Right, it just is able to work with that car.

Yeah, but it's just like, I mean, right now with the industry, it sucks how many things are locked and then how much time it takes for the aftermarket to catch up with it. And it's like, if you're going to unlock an ECU, the warranty is gone anyways. So like, people want to buy cars to modify. And like, why stop us? Like, you're gonna, like, if you take it to the dealer, they're gonna know in an instant if you modified it.

What are your thoughts on where the industry is gonna go there in the next few years? Is it gonna be easier or harder to modify?

That's a great question. I think it's gonna be varied on the companies and just what their mindsets are. But like, cars are expensive right now. I mean, we look at how much a car was 10 years ago to where a car is today. If you wanna move more cars, let people modify them. I mean, if they wanna throw their warranty out, let them throw their warranty out, who cares? And so, I think that's a great way. I mean, look at like, let's go back to the Hellcat and the 392, right? I mean, how many of those are modified? Incredible. And the reason people bought those cars is because you could modify them. So why are you gonna stop that target consumer from wanting to buy that car? Because I feel like there's gonna be, yeah, like there's companies out there, like Stellantis did it, Ford's doing it, where they're doing the, where you can get the factory tunes, like the upgraded tunes. But for us, is that really, that's not enough.

Yeah.

You know, like, cool.

It'll be cool for a week.

It bumped it up 100 horse. That's great, but I want another 400 or 500. And how do we do that? And how do we do it with either a factory ECU, but then you look at what HP Tuners is doing, where they're doing standalongs. And so, but then you think about, you know, that's again going back to how much time it takes to develop something like that.

Right. Well, it's also difficult because cars are getting more and more integrated. Like, for example, the guy we had on last week, his Camaro, like, that he, it's like 2017 ZL1. It's like he has to rip all this out, take out the dash, you know. But I think it's like the phone charger.

The rear wireless charger made it so the car wouldn't run. Yeah. So we had to find a way to bypass that to get it to...

Because when the canvas can't talk, it literally...

Yeah.

Like, once you pull a sensor, it like shuts it down.

Which you probably deal with a lot because I've heard the neural network in the Dodge is a real pain in the a**.

Yeah. And I mean, I'm sure there's a million reasons why they do it, but it's like, do you want more people? You want to sell cars, right?

Yeah.

Plain and simple.

No, it doesn't matter what they, I mean, they're coming out with some pretty bad, it's like already race cars out the box, right?

But then you get used to it and then you want more.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, that's the thing. Like you're an automotive enthusiast, like, you know, like no car is ever finished.

Yeah.

You know, either you sell it or you just, you keep tinkering with it. And you know, like it's, you're always going to try, like, especially like, you know, you've got all these aftermarket companies.

Daisy. Best friend. This chair might collapse under me though.

You know, and you've got so much, you have so many aftermarket companies that are developing products, you know, when the next latest and greatest thing comes out, whether it's a new supercharger, a new turbos, new whatever, like you're going to want that, you know.

Well, then it's going to be a race to like, look what Whipple and Ford are doing. It's going to be a race to who can be in bed with the OEM. And then they're going to be king s*** if that happens. You know, I mean, they're going to be, that's your only option now. That kind of sucks, too, for the industry.

Yeah.

I really, really hope, we talked a bit about this at PRI. I really hope that Dodge can bring something to kind of show Ford and Chevy what's up, because the ZR1, we just got the pricing on that, which is ridiculous. And obviously, you got the GTD, which the pricing is ridiculous. But nonetheless, it's like these cars are awesome. So I'm excited to see where the industry goes.

Yeah, I mean, look at how the industry's pulled back on the EV side.

Huge. Oh, like a light switch.

Yeah. And so now, you're seeing a transition to hybrid, which hybrid has its place, and it's great. I mean, having that instant power, you can't beat that. Yeah. But at the end of the day, an enthusiast is going to hear the sound of a car. Right. And like my 4XE Jeeps, I have a blast off-roading with them, wheeling with them, and I think there's a lot of potential still there from upgrading them, tuning them, everything like that. But do electric cars have their place? Sure. Could I daily drive an electric car? Yeah. But is there anything out there that I like right now? No. I think one of the platforms that I'm excited to drive is the Ram Charger to be able to have, it's a fully electric truck, but then it's using the gas motor as a generator.

I'm stoked for that one. Let's see how that goes.

So, it's got plenty of power, and then you never have to worry about range anxiety.

Was it like 600 or 900 mile range on it or something? Ridiculous like that.

Because you can run the EV out, and then the generator can kick on to recharge, and then if you run that out, you just fill with gas and you're good to go. I think that's where I see the market going, but then how does the aftermarket integrate with that?

Yeah. Are you excited for the Hurricane to be in the new charger?

Yes.

Are you going to try to dabble with that almost immediately, or are you just going to wait till someone brings you a project or...?

Well, I think with... We've got some extra Hurricane engines. The next Hurricane project is I've got a two-door Wrangler. We're going to throw one in because I think that'd be fun as hell.

You say two-door Wrangler?

Yeah.

Oh, that one right there. I was wondering what's going to go on that. I'm like, huh, I see a 2.0 in here. What's this all about?

Yeah. We're going to Hurricane swap that.

Okay.

Yeah.

I mean, do I want to do that?

Yeah.

But would I rather throw a demon motor in it?

Yeah.

I'd really do that. I mean, I honestly, I think... I don't think anyone's going to take the time right now to gut the EV side, just because I feel like the cost there is just astronomical.

Well, you had to go around the packaging.

Yes. And so I think people wait for the gas version and then figure out, are you pretty much like bastardizing the car and cutting it up? Yeah. But you know what's going to happen within six months of that. Within six months, you're going to see a Hellcat swap.

Well, I saw an article that kept showing up in my Facebook. It's like, oh yeah, can a Hemi fit in the new charger and everybody's like, yeah, it probably can.

I don't believe it does.

Yeah?

Yeah, I don't think it fits.

I'm curious to see how that shakes out.

Are there some other people out there right now messing around with the Hurricane stuff?

Once all the RHOs started getting delivered, like two weeks ago, it's all over right now, everyone's doing the piggyback. So it's who can either do a standalone or crack it.

Yeah.

Or that's the big thing right now. But yeah, I know when we were at PRI, I was getting a million questions about it, and I'm like, it's a locked ECU currently. But I mean, I don't think it's going to take much longer to see someone get a little further into it.

Who are some of your regular partners that you like working with? Because you've built a lot of relationships over the last few years.

Yeah. I mean, that's a long list.

Yeah, I'm sure.

There's the OEM side. Tires, like all my stuff runs Mickey Thompson's. Wheels, I've run Vision, I've run KMC, I've run Detroit Steel Wheel, I've run, I'm trying to think, weld on like part side, like the off-road world. You know, I do a lot with rigid industries, do a lot with Rock Crawler, do a lot with MB Court, do a lot with Steersmarts, Catskin Leather, Gulf Coast Drive Shaft, and pretty much all my cars. Trimek, dude, that's a long list.

Just send to me an e-mail or Excel sheet.

You know, like working with Magnuson right now on a Supercharger. I could keep going.

Yeah.

Just kind of off the top of my head.

Yeah. Well, again, I keep coming back to this. Like, you know, it's been since 2012 or whatever. It's like you've done quite a bit in arguably a short period of time, even though some days might be long. Yeah. I mean, I guess my question to you is, is what kind of allows you to do that? Is it just that you come to the table with ideas, you care about helping the other side, a combination of that?

I would say it's a combination. You know, like when we're putting a proposal together for Build, because sometimes the OEMs will reach out to me and say, hey, we're going to provide this vehicle, what can you do with it? And so that's when I will put a full deck together of, these are the partners, these are who we're going to use, this is the events we're going to. Is there a partnership that you want to be involved with? Do I got to purchase stuff? It's all good, but it's creating those, I want those relationships to last as long as they can. And yeah, it's just, it's, your word's everything. And so, and I think a lot of people, like from a manufacturing side, get burned by people not holding up their end of whatever deal that has been put together. And so that's kind of like always my big thing is like, I'll have people reach out to me, oh, can you get me these parts? And I'm like, no. Like, are you doing it just because, or are actually like you're gonna be out there like marketing for them? You know, I just don't want someone who just wants like a part for vehicle just because, like I wanna make sure they're gonna be an ambassador for that brand.

We've done a lot of collaboration with like influencers and such, but now you mentioned like that you're gonna build out like your content side of things now with 5 O Clock Garage. What's that gonna look like?

I think it's gonna be like a variety of gist. I feel like I'm kinda in, I cover the whole kinda automotive side of things. It's gonna be, I think, one like what we do with the vehicles, but also like how we modify them and how if like showcasing, like company's products, following along with the builds, following along with our issues. Yes, do we wanna go out there and have fun like I'm gonna be doing this weekend? Absolutely. But also to be informative to like why we use certain parts. So that's kind of, you know, and just keep people interested. I mean, it's like one of the big things that, you know, you always run in, I feel like the industry has seen is it's also really hard to get good employees across the board. It's just going back to like people wanna be in automotive. But then when it comes to the work, you know, that's, you know, do you really wanna do it? And I think that's kind of where we wanna go with the content side is again, like being a brand ambassador, but also being fun and being fun with all of our projects. You know, that's my big thing is like, do I love going fast and fun? Yeah, am I worried about like winning some drag race event? No, like I wanna, like I was telling you guys earlier, like there's always gonna be someone faster. I just wanna make sure I'm always like, is it fun? And if it's not fun, then I'm not gonna do it. You know, you only got so much time.

What's the best bang for buck fun you've ever had? Surf and turf.

Surf and turf. Like from a car standpoint, I mean, that's the most fun car, I think.

The Demon?

Yeah, that thing is like, it's, you don't need to do anything to it. No, I mean, between that or like a Wrangler, like my diesel Gladiator, like that thing is, you know, it's on 40s and it's like, it's a great daily driver and I can off road it anywhere. But no, from like a standpoint of like a car value, I mean, like C6 Corvettes, C7 Corvettes, and then like you get into like the 392s, like Charger Challenger, like, I mean, there's not a car out there that you can get a better value for. And like, you can't beat those. You go out and have fun with them, drift them, sounds good, they're comfortable, and you're not putting a whole lot of money in it.

Yeah.

One thing that makes me so mad is when the Europeans start talking about like American interiors and grants, they're right most of the time. But dude, until you're in like a wide body Charger with, you know, the nappa leather and everything, that is like, I like that.

All the seats are incredible.

Flying couch.

Yeah. Yeah. That's the best part. Like, you can drive those things all day. Yeah. So I know I love American Muscle. I mean, price point for everything like sucks right now. And so that's kind of like, I feel like when people ask what new car I should buy, I'm like, like, you know, what's like, what's your budget? Like, there's so many used cars out there that are great value still.

Everything starts at 60,000 nowadays.

Yeah. And that's like, you know, like there's a lot of cars out there that are house payments.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, but no, I mean, like, both the time I'm driving my old Audi A6. Gets great gas mileage on it. Air gets me from A to B.

Well, I know that you're, you have a out time here shortly. So, I mean, before we do our usual three, is there anything else that you want to catch on that?

What do you think built your network the most? Would it be M1, just that whole process?

I would say a lot of it is M1, and then just figuring out what events to go to, and just putting myself out there, and getting uncomfortable. It's always like, you gotta get uncomfortable, and put yourself in situations that you're not used to, and then learn to get comfortable with it, so then you can learn how to approach people, how to talk to them. But yeah, I would say between M1, and just going to a lot of shows, and not being afraid to talk to people.

Yeah, they say that the people that do that I tend to live a little bit longer.

I hope so.

Unless you fall out of a Blackhawk helicopter in the mountains, then it might change.

Yeah.

All right, what's going on here?

Daisy.

Being all subductive.

Come here.

What's the most uncomfortable thing you've done? I'm just making you rack your memory today, I know.

Oh man. I would say probably like the biggest like, pucker moment was when I was wheeling that Wagoneer and Moab, and I had it up. It was, had one wheel off the ground and it started tilting, and everyone's like, stop, we want to take a photo. And I'm like, I'm going to kill all of you. Like that was the pucker moment because if it went, I was rolling over and down a 700-foot cliff in the Colorado River. So I'd probably say that one.

Yeah, that'll do it.

That was pretty sketch.

Yeah.

Have you ever been to like Pikes Peak or anything yet?

Not yet.

Not yet? Yeah, just build a time-attack car or something?

One day. Yeah. In due time.

Yeah. Well, I'm sure the next few years are going to get rowdy for you.

Oh, absolutely.

Yeah.

Got to keep it going.

Yeah. Well, sweet, then. You want to pop the usual three?

Yeah, absolutely.

This might be the most absurd one yet.

Yeah, we'll see. Yeah. All right. So at the end of every episode, we like to ask our guests to pick three cars. I'm just f****** that up this week.

Here, I'll let you restart it.

All right. At the end of every episode, we like to ask our guests to pick three cars, a daily driver, a track car, and a show car. You have an unlimited budget. You can build whatever you want, swap wherever you want.

Unlimited budget. Daily driver. I mean, because I don't really give a s*** when it comes to daily, like what my car would be for a daily driver. Daily driver. Let me think here. Dude, like I want like a semi truck. Like a Kenworth. I would daily drive like a Peterbilt, something like that. Just a fully custom truck. Like, yeah, that's stupid, but I feel like that'd be just the most fun.

This would be like, that truck never has a load on it for some reason.

Yeah. Track car. P1.

Okay.

I love the McLaren P1. I think that thing's awesome. And then show car.

Is that what we saw in Vegas in the showroom at the McLaren thing?

No, no, that was like a special edition 720. That was like a one of like 10 in the world. Oh, yeah.

And then like a show car.

No, 765, that's what it was.

Okay. I would say like just off the top of my head, it was at Autorama last year, Corrupt Builds, did a Hellcat swap 300, and it was like everything he did about it. Like it was like gray and like it was like a gloss gray and then Matt did thing was gangster. Like that car I fell in love with, you know, and then I was like my, I would say between that, okay, there's probably one car if I had, I wouldn't know, it would be like an F40. I love the Ferrari F40. Or, no, but yeah, F40, I don't know. It's kind of between that and the F50.

We're not gonna take a coffee break, you think on it.

Yeah, yeah, I'd say, you know, I would, the problem is I would daily drive everything.

Yeah.

That's the issue.

Well, you have them all.

If you have all three of them, you can, you know, nobody's gonna be mad at you if you pick a different one to drive for the day.

Yeah, but yeah, from a daily though, if I had one thing, I'd definitely want to drive a semi every day. It's sweet.

You have to get a horn to do it.

Oh, for sure.

Yeah.

Have you driven one?

Yeah.

Yeah?

Yeah, it's the best.

Yeah.

I'm surprised you didn't say helicopter for a daily driver.

I haven't done that yet. One day. I'm gonna get my Palates license.

Well, I have to make you pick now, F40 or F50. Got a lock date in?

F50.

F50. I've been hearing that more and more from this generation.

Yeah, F50.

Yeah. Well, on that note, where can everybody find you?

Motor City Mad on Instagram, and then from the shop page, 5 O Clock Garage.

Okay.

So, sweet.

If somebody wanted to order stickers and all that s***, still go to 5 O Clock or where would you go to?

So, we're actually building a new website right now, and then through that, it'll break out into all of the different brands we work with, and then you can contact us for anything custom.

Okay.

So, yeah.

Sweet.

Thanks, guys. I appreciate it.

Yeah. This is awesome. Where can people find you, Matt? Matt? Dan? Dan? You're not the only one f****** up this week. Yeah.

That's right. You can find us at Gunner Garage. I'm going to go take the sleds out on the lake hopefully this weekend, so we can get some kind of snowmobile s*** going and go from there. I'm going to have my own little mini snow dig.

I'll send you some pics this weekend.

Yeah.

I'm going to rub it in.

Yeah. Most of Dan's goodbye sentiments start with I hope, and then sled, and then nothing ever happens.

After last year, man, just left me fiending, and now I'm getting teased this year and it's not quite happening yet.

Yeah. There's not a whole lot of snow right now, at least in these parts.

And everybody and anybody is in the UP right now, so I don't even want to go up there. That's too many a******* for me.

Well, sweet. Matt, thank you for making this happen. Glad you had us. Dan, thanks for existing, and we'll see you all next time.